IAmAn Air Traffic Controller. Tomorrow the FAA will open an off the street hiring bid for ATC. This is a 6 figure job that does not require a degree. AMA.

Why are Controllers mostly assholes?

I didn’t mean it, bro. Your sequence wasn’t that bad.

My ex's father is one, I was told there's a high burn-out rate. Is that right?

Washout, not burnout. The academy has about a 50% washout rate. It’s higher for En Route than Terminal. Then each facility has its own training success rate. Some are harder to certify at than others. But if you are a good employee and show promise, you may be able to relocate to an easier facility if you wash out at your first.

Why is enroute a higher washout?

It’s just harder at the academy

Somewhat unrelated here, does anyone know of other opportunities like this in other fields? Or where to look? I'm unhappy with my career and would like an adventure like this, but I'm already 36. Thanks.

There are other opportunities within the FAA, such as tech ops. They work with ATC to keep our equipment, radars, navaids, etc running.

With this type of off-the-street hiring with no experience? If so I'll look into it.

Correct

Affirmative

Unable

Hi thanks for doing this!! I was reading some of the medical examinations expectations and am unsure if I can pass the eye exams. Can these tests be done with glasses on or does one need contacts and or lasik?

Sure thing! The eye examination is based on your corrected vision.

I’m absolutely blind without my contacts.

I can't smell without my wig.

Have you tried rotating?

Is the Academy a resident program? How long is it?

Are there certain locations that are more likely for first assignments?

Is full retirement 20 or 30 years?

The academy is 3 or 4 months, depending if you are selected for Terminal or En Route. Your facility choices could be literally anywhere in the country, and are determined based off the staffing needs at the time you finish at the academy.

You can retire with full benefits after 20 years of “good time”. Every year you stay beyond that adds 1% to your pension, with a mandatory retirement at age 56 with few exceptions.

What is the accrual rate for the first 20 years, 1.7%?

Yep

What is terminal vs en route

Terminal is a tower, approach, or tower/approach combo (“up down”). En Route is center (Think high altitude and everything in between terminal airspace)

So is TRACON the Enroute or the Terminal? Only because I live in STL and I know we have a Tower and a TRACON I didn’t know if they were different or the same.

One of my aircraft dispatchers told me this job opened, another is applying but I’m getting burned out because I’ve hit my highest promotion with this regional. This thread literally is giving me hope that I have found something I can put my skills into.

TRACON is Terminal. STL isn’t an up down, meaning their Tower and TRACON are split. You either work at one or the other. Both are above a level , however, so you can’t go there straight out of the academy.

This is my Dream job and I really want to apply tomorrow but I only have 2 years work experience and some volunteer babysitting work, I’m 18 and just start community college? Is there any point in applying? Or will I just be turned down, I have a family friend who’s a controller and he said just to apply and take a chance because it may not matter but I don’t want to get in trouble

It never hurts to apply, but it sounds like you don’t meet the minimum requirements. Keep an eye out for the next one once you have 3 years of full time work experience! You’re so young that if you stay dedicated, you should eventually get in.

1. Would there be any reason to worry about being laid off within the next 20-30 years?

2. What locations are the most likely a new controller would work at?

3. How much downtime does an ATC typically get during a shift? I assume you’re not staring at a screen and keeping ears on for 8-12 hours a day.

4. Is it really all that stressful/demanding? Do you go home feeling burned out most days?

5. What kind of steps/promotions beyond being an ATC are there and what do you think about those positions? (Management/Union Rep/trainer/FAA/etc)

6. I imagine there a positions that are on-call to cover sick/vacation days, are they paid a guarantee?

7. If I want to move after being qualified to an open position at another terminal, how is training for a new location handled/paid?

8. Do you get any unofficial perks for being an ATC? Cheaper flights/free “deadheads”?

9. Can you take a leave of absence and maintain certifications? Is it hard to come back after an extended leave (personal/injury)?

1. No

2. Literally anywhere in the country

3. We work 8 hour shifts, and can’t work more than 10 hours per day by law. So no 12 hour shifts. On a typical day, we work 1 hour on, 30 minutes off. On a fat-staffed day, 1 hour on, 1 hour off.

4. No

5. Once you’re a CPC, that’s it. You get an extra 10% when you’re training somebody. Most CPCs get the training course to become OJTI’s. Supervisors lose differential pay, so they end up making about the same.

6. If somebody calls in sick and we go below minimum staffing, people get called in for OT in order. Whoever takes it gets 1.5 times pay.

7. If it’s a higher pay facility, you get half the difference on the go, half when you certify. Lower facility, you save pay if your current pay falls within that band. If you make more, you go to the top of the band of the lower facility.

8. No. We can do Flight Deck Training twice per year where we ride jumpseat in the cockpit of a participating airline. It can’t be attached to vacation, though.

9. You have to stay current. If you lose currency because of an extended leave, you have to recertify.

I'd love to become an ATC and think I'd excel at it but alas, I'm 31. Why the age cutoff?

Mandatory retirement at 56

That doesn't answer his question. Why must applicants be 30 years old or younger to apply?

It’s a young person’s career. Past a certain age your skills degrade to a point where you can no longer perform the job, and the FAA needs to get its investment out of you. Also you need to be able to accrue enough time for your pension.

That’s the best I’ve got.

Isn't it illegal to discriminate because of age?

Not for this job

Why is that? Like is there a specific exemption out is there something that I'm missing about the age discrimination laws

I don’t know. I just know that it’s legal.

How long will the application period be open for?

It’s typically open for 2-3 days. My best guess is end of business Monday.

Ok, one more for ya. If my application was accepted how long would I have before taking the AT-SA test? Basically how much time would I have to start studying?

1-2 months

does not require a degree.

If you were not from the armed forces, what's the actual chances?

Same as anyone else

What's the actual numbers tho?

I don’t have exact numbers. Veterans get a vet pref bonus, but there are at least 50% I would say who are not prior military.

And how many of them don't have a degree?

A degree is 100% not required. The FAA does not care if you have one or not. Having a 4 year degree simply allows you to meet their requirement. HR does not compare resumes. The single determining factor in whether or not you advance is your score on the AT-SA.

Just apply. Any job that doesn't require a degree will always prefer one, that's the truth.

That’s not the case for this job. Your score on the AT-SA is all that matters.

This job sounds like exactly what I need but, if I have the 3 years of full time work experience but it is not at all related to the position (I have customer service, waiting tables, warehouse work, etc.) will that poorly effect my chances or are they just looking for the experience in general?

No. You do not need any related work experience whatsoever.

Thank you so much for replying, I fully intend on applying once I get home; thank you again.

Absolutely! Let me know if you have any more questions.

Is the washout rate still 80+%?

It’s closer to 50%

Working on getting my resume up and will probably submit my application tomorrow morning! What are the chances of actually getting in the for the exam? Does everyone get a stab at it as long as they meet the qualifications?

Yes. They will close the bid once they have received enough applicants.

Wait a minute, I’m assuming you’re on break right now... 😁

Nice try, supe

I completed the application through the USA Jobs website and was redirected a questionnaire on the FAA website. Is that questionnaire the Biographical Assessment (BA)? And after completing that questionnaire, is my next step just to wait for a reply?

Thank you.

The BQ is gone, so that may just be some generic questionnaire thing for statistical purposes or something. I’m not sure.

I commented earlier about something but now that it’s closed (sigh, I was told too late) how often does this usually open?

Based on recent history, I would expect this June.

Possibly unrelated but, in general, what do the Short Term Incentives look like for EV banded staff?

Sorry, I don’t know what that is.

Proof

I'm impatient, bipolar, use recreational drugs, and my vision isn't quite fully able to be corrected. Do you think I should give it a shot?

I also might have trouble passing a background test if thst makes a difference.

You’re hired.

I worked casually as a radar operator for half an hour or so once (I will not try to explain) and it was really hard to pay attention to all of the squiggles on the screen.... that will help too, right?

Even better.

If I put in for the job req, make it pretty far by some miracle, withdraw my application, and then decide I want to apply again after that in the future, would my previous withdrawal impact my last application?

Most likely

I have six months full time work experience, four years part time, and was a full time student for two years with an associate's. Do I have a shot?

They do say you can have a “combination” of a degree and work experience. I don’t know how they weigh it, but it doesn’t hurt to apply.

It's basically weighted as a percentage of the total nessesary to qualify on either one by itself. So if you have 2 years of education, that's 50%, and 1.5 years of experience, that's 50%, and you qualify. The percents have to add up to 100%.

I worked in the government for a while and learned a lot about their HR system. Stuff like that is standard throughout all agencies.

That’s good to know if that’s the case. Thanks!

Anyway to maximize your chances? I love everything aviation, PilotEdge etc... but it seems they don't care about candidates interests in Aviation, just the status quo. So anything I can do to stand out?

Ace the AT-SA. That’s literally the only thing that matters.

Does everyone get to take it now? Last time I applied for the open bid, I got disqualified by the BQ questionnaire.

The BQ is gone

Yeah, I know. I guess my question is, does everyone get to take the AT-SA now?

Yeah

What do you do on your work breaks?

Rest, video games, ping pong, YouTube, etc

I believe 18 if you somehow have 3 years of full time work experience. I know of a 20 year old who got hired under those conditions.

What does a typical work day look like for an atc? What does the work itself actually entail?

Most 24 hour facilities run a rotating shift. So my schedule is:

• Fri 1420-2220
• Sat 1300-2100
• Sun 0700-1500
• Mon 0600-1400, then 2206-0606 for the overnight
• Tues OFF after 0606
• Wed OFF
• Thurs OFF

Typical work day is 1 hour on position, 30 minutes off.

I can only speak to a terminal facility. Im at O' Hare. Everyone goes up and typically works 4 sessions a day with breaks in between. If you are in training, you can expect to train during at least 2 of those sessions with one of your 3 assigned trainers. If you are fully certified you come upstairs and are assigned a position by the supervisor (usually youre releaving the person who has been on position the longest). Depending on many factors but typically staffing, you can expect to work that position from an hour to an hour and a half then given a 30-45 minute break. afterwords you come up and do it all again, most likely at a different position than what you worked last. Until your 8 hour shift is up. Then you go to the bar.

Psh. With all the ground stops y’all have, you really only work every other day ;)

Thanks for the reply, but I wasn't asking about the schedule so much as the details of what you're actually doing on the job. Like are you just staring at a radar and relaying info to pilots? Are there are other duties associated with it? That sort of thing.

Though now that you mention the schedule, is it typical for the schedule to be that sporadic? I'd think it would more sense for everyone to have the same hours every day they work.

If I’m in the tower, I’m issuing clearances to pilots, taxiing aircraft to and from the active runway, and clearing aircraft to takeoff and land, among some other minor duties.

If I’m in the TRACON working radar, the most of the time I’m vectoring aircraft for approach to airports, climbing departing aircraft out of my airspace, and talking to overflights, again among other lesser duties.

The main aspect of the job is moving aircraft without letting them touch.

And yes that’s a typical schedule for 24 hour facilities, which most are.

Thoughts on privatizing ATC in the US? It seems like the Canadian model really opened them up to investing in better technology and management, without the whiplash of federal budget issues.

I had a relative work with the FAA (liaison from military) and found the union impossible to deal with. Curious what it's like from the other side of those stories.

I can’t speak for the union as a whole. I can say that from my perspective, the biggest concern with privatization is the unknown. We have it pretty good right now as far as pay and retirement.

I turn 31 on Wednesday, is this "bid" going to close by then?

Also, I have a B.S. in biology but no education/work experience related to being an ATC... worth taking a shot? Thanks!

It should be closed by then, so you’ll just make it!

And no aviation experience is necessary at all.

What color is your toothbrush?

Blue and white

Cool, thanks

Anytime.

Since you have that profession, have you ever gotten to do anything for the USAF?

Edit: typo

Do you mean was I ever in the Air Force? If so, then no.