I am a NASP competition archer who, for the first 4 years of shooting, could not see the target; AMA!

How pissed off were your teammates when they learned you were beating them when you couldn't even see?

Actually, they were incredibly impressed and supportive. Most of us have known eachother for even longer than the team's existed, so we've grown up together and practically became a family. Some of my closest friends are on that team and I couldn't ask for a better support system.

Reading that just made my heart warm. You have some awesome friends/teammates OP. Those are true ride or die friends.

Thank you so much!

If not your teammates, how about your rivals?

Actually I'd kinda feel bad. I'd always get put next to like tiny little kids (I'm the one average sized guy on our team, 5'5, all the other guys are like 6'2) so they dont get intimidated by a fecking mountain. So as a result, after every, single, tournament, I'd have to explain to really young kids that they will eventually climb the learning curve and get really really good.

How old are you? You must not drive or it would have been discovered. How did you study in school not being able to see the board?

I went through a similar experience growing up. Couldn't see shit, mom said I didn't need glasses. Couldn't pass driver sight test. Guess who needed glasses all those years....

I'm only 14, so yeah, no driver's license yet lol. In schooling though, since I'm homeschooled, most of my classes are either online or a 1 on 1 with a professor, or I'm teaching the class, as a surprising result, my vision wasn't tested much. The only time it got in the way was in a chemistry class last year in which I couldn't see the board, so I just studied extra so I wouldn't need it and just didnt take particular note of it.

Edit: When I say my vision wasn't tested much, I dont mean like optometrist tests, I mean utilized in real world applications.

"Huh, I can't see the board but everyone around me can...

Guess I'll just study extra hard"

I admire your work ethic lol. Seems like nothing will ever stop you from being your best :)

Just trying to be nice, give people as many chances as possible, and be someone to look up to :)

Look, if you apply these ethics in your life forever and strive hard. I could see u being something great.

I'm going for that, but I'm happy where I am. As long as I keep some good friends and am doing something I enjoy, I'll be happy. :)

You can't be 14. You must be a 300 year old monk living in a mystic cave.
For real now, keep going like this 🙂🤙

I guard the secrets of the ancient high metabolism

For real though, thanks man, trying to stay positive no matter what :)

Did you not notice your vision becoming blurry? or were you always near-sighted since you were born?

Cause a lot of my friends got near-sighted just around when puberty hit. And my friend told me he noticed the decline quickly, like one day he couldn't read the board or registration plates.

I dont recall a time where my vision was naturally good, so I guess I was born with it.

Work smarter not harder man...

I mean, I worked harder to get smarter, does that count?

That's some fucking Rock Lee shit right there.

That right there is a platinum medal worthy comment, unfortunately I'm broke.

SOMEBODY GET THIS GUY A MEDAL

As a competitive archer, can you comment on how scientifically acccurate this video is?

More than you'd think...

There's whistle protocols where if a whistle is blown rapidly, by anyone, anywhere, anytime, every archer must calmly release tension on the bow, un-knock any arrows, and get out of stance.

And back when our team didnt have much funding, we used to operate out of a barn in pflugerville, where people would often go to take pictures... behind the barn wall we were shooting at... which was an old wooden barn and had cracks, so the "moving target" joke was made quite a lot.

Hey I used to live in Pflugerville! Small world sometimes lol.

Really seems like that some days, doesn't it lol?

What was it like to suddenly see so much more clearly? How did you feel during those first few days/weeks/months?

As a guy its hard to admit this but, I cried. Going from barely being able to read overhead menus at restaurants all the way to seeing the leaves on trees 500 feet away was absolutely breathtaking. I kept noticing new little things I never even knew existed. Even today I'm still occasionally finding little things that, when I take off my glasses, just disappear.

As a guy its hard to admit this but, I cried.

I just want to tell you: you never need to feel ashamed of your emotions. Own them. Men can cry, and we don't need any special excuse to make it acceptable. To hell with anyone who tells you otherwise.

seeing the leaves on trees 500 feet away was absolutely breathtaking

It's funny, but this is usually the thing people bring up when talking about getting glasses. I remember it like it was yesterday, even though it was really... geez, must be almost twenty years ago now haha.

I wore glasses for six years, and then switch to contacts. My prescription is bad enough (-7.0ish) that changing to contacts was pretty significant because the refraction that glasses produce makes everything look much smaller than it really is. Suddenly I could see and everything was real-size. I remember that day vividly, too.

Thank you, so much.

And I tried contacts, but unfortunately my eyes dont open wide enough to get them in or out, so I'll just have to wait for later eye surgery once I'm old enough.

unfortunately my eyes dont open wide enough to get them in or out

My mom literally forced my eyelids open enough to change the contacts for the first year hahaha. I'm not proud of it... but now I can get them in and out with more ease than anyone else I know! (I don't know why, but my eyelids just really really really didn't want to let contacts in at first. Bodies are weird.)

But each person's experience is their own. If it makes you uncomfortable then of course don't force it.

I've thought of laser eye surgery too, but there are just enough negative stories that I'm wary haha. We'll see if I eventually get over it and go for it. I wish you the best of luck, though!

Yeah, only problem is I'm the like the "fit" person in the house so I'm always up way earlier than everyone for a morning jog, so unfortunately I need a solution that I can do myself. Thanks though!

Now I want to see what your eyes look like... I'm Asian and don't have any issues, whilst my white colleague just couldn't stop motherfucking blinking whilst trying to put lenses in. =_=;

My eyes aren't particularly tiny, they are small dont get me wrong, but it's also to do with that they're more sunken into my head. So on top of the fact they're not the biggest and dont open very wide, it's also incredibly hard to manually open my eyes wide enough.

It's all practice. I used to have days where I could sit for hours and never get them in.

Now its a quick plop and theyre both in, out, and in again. You have to get used to having fingers round your eyeball etc. There are contacts in different sizes for different eyes aswell.

Even the optometrist struggled to get them in, so I think that was just my calling to switch to glasses.

Something worth crying over happens, it’s totally cool to cry. Men have as much a right to tears as anyone of any gender.

Thank you, I appreciate every ounce of support I'm getting from you wonderful people.

As a former baseball player who needed glasses but didn’t start wearing them for years, I remember being constantly amazed at seeing individual blades of grass! It’s those little things that you didn’t even know you were supposed to see that are the coolest!

Exactly! The biggest thing for me was that like reflections, both just light bouncing off things and mirrors, became so enhanced and crisp. Everything just felt brighter and happier and it actually pulled me out of a slightly depressive phase.

Did it blow your mind you see that trees have details from a distance?

That's an understatement, it changed my world in more ways than I can say. It was such a big change it was like an art piece, it just reached out to my soul in so many different meanings it completely changed the way I think.

That’s so beautiful. I can’t believe you’re only 14 dude! I’m twice your age and you seem far more eloquent and wise than I am. I’ve been really enjoying reading through all these comments.

I can only thank my parents, they're doing everything they can to teach me everything I need to know and I'm so thankful for them.

Man, this reminds me: I really need to go see an optometrist.

My vision was fine at your age, but now I have to use the zoom function on my phone to see parts of the whiteboard that aren't directly in front of me, even though I sit in the front of the class.

That was definitely a little trick I used a lot once I knew I needed glasses but didnt have them lol.

Man, I remember the day I got glasses and realized that individual leaves were visible from so far away. I was about the same age you are.

Hell of a thing, huh?

Very much so.

That’s amazing, are you proficient in different forms of archery. Western, Chinese or Kyudo?

Thank you!

And not to my knowledge, and definitely not professionally. I've messed around with various bow types, draw strengths, stances, arrow types, etc., so I'm sure I've probably practiced some style accidentally, but not anymore than as a joke or curiosity.

That’s cool if wanted to learn archery as skill what’s a good bow for a beginner?

The genesis line of bows are amazing, although slightly expensive. I've had the same one (featured in pic) for all 4 years without any major breaks or wear. Also, the addition of a customizable draw strength is great for beginners, in case you're not quite ready for the full weight and/or need to frequently switch strengths. NASP competitions require use of the standard/medium bow (again, the one featured in the pic) which I believe has a range of 10-20 lbs, however theres a mini bow, for younger kids, and a professional bow with a much higher range (not entirely sure what it is).

Recurve bows I've noticed are all generally pretty good, as long as you dont go for like a $20 one from Walmart lol.

Do your parents not believe in doctors? Serious question, since you should have had your vision checked. My nephew at age one had glasses, doctors don't even need your cooperation to diagnose.

Quite the opposite actually, my parents are incredibly scientifically educated, luckily lol. I'm not sure how, but I always got pretty average eye exam results, if not, only barely off. I think my eyes independently are slightly better than when they're together, so during exams I could just barely make an educated guess on the letters, whereas in real life I'd fail to read street signs from the passenger seat of the car.

What was your strategy for hitting the target when it wasn’t visible to you?

Well in competitions theres 8 rounds, 4 at 10 metres, 4 at 15. The 1st and 5th rounds, beginnings of the respective distances, are practice rounds, meaning no matter how good or bad of a score you got, they wouldn't count. I'd use those rounds to just aim dead center of the target (I could see a blob, but nothing more), when we'd go to collect the arrows I'd make note of where they hit, then just counter that so they'd hit the center the next round.

Do you shoot compound or recurve? Both? More traditional? This is very inspiring!

NASP competitions require use of the standard genesis 10-20lb compound bow, so as a result it's the bow I tend to practice with the most. I have multiple compounds and a 60lb recurve (not sure of make or model), so I do have experience with more than just the bow in the picture.

60 lbs recurve at 14? You must have some extreme back muscles

No one ever said a nerd cant be strong lol

Do you practice only with glasses now, or do you do it blind?

With glasses, as stated, they've increased my scores dramatically, I wish I always had them lol.

Hey there ! I’m also shoot for 3 years now buts it’s always on and off I see it more as just something fun to do then to become competitive :) but some questions I have is

When I’m holding back the string I always am shaking. I’ve always had shakes my entire life so it’s not that it’s too heavy. I shoot a 35pd brownie ? I think it’s called.

Thanks a lot !

Simple answer is: too much weight! And an equally simple solution, just set back the draw strength or use a lighter bow and build up to that 35lbs, should take about 2 months at the longest to get up to it. If you dont have an adjustable bow (unfortunately couldn't find the bow you were talking about, so you'll have to look this up) or a lighter bow, simple arm and core exercises like curls, push-ups, planks, and general stretches will help build up arm strength, as well as keep you in basic shape.

Complex answer: are you transfering? Transfering is when you get the string fully pulled back, you shift the weight from your biceps to your shoulders and back. It should feel like you're pinching your shoulder blades together. Your shoulders and back are a lot stronger than your arms, so once you get the weight back, move it to the stronger area.

Could be target panic that turned into a habit.

Maybe? I never really get too nervous about much, so if it is, I wouldn't recognize it.

I shoot as well out in west Texas I’m currently building a Mathews trx 40 hoping to get dialed in for some ten x’s what setup do you run?

Edit: sorry didn’t look to hard at the picture I like the green genesis looks good.

Lol its okay, dont really use anything than bare bows so I unfortunately can't help you. But yeah, green genesis is a beauty.

It took you four years to figure out you need glasses?

It's not like I had a side by side comparison to normal vision. The only time I found out is when I wore my friends glasses and saw pretty close to actual vision.

How did you get into archery? Was it something that interested you for a while, or was it something you stumbled on and loved?

Actually I used to be in a co-op, which is like a once a week "school" but all of the classes were created by other kids and you could choose which ones you wanted to go to, granted you needed to pick a minimum number so you wouldn't just be wandering around all day. I chose mine but I was still one short and didn't see any others that interested me. Then I saw an archery class and thought "Eh... at least it's not baking". At the end of the semester we held a competition for the best shot and who ever won got to keep their class provided bow and the target (both face and base) they won on. My last arrow came out lucky and there I came out 5 years ago, on a new life path I didnt know would change my life.

In case you're curious, I still have that target hung up to this day. http://imgur.com/gallery/8tgjRLN

Did you say “I am not left-handed either!!”?

Well it's a right handed bow, it's just upside down in the pic.

Edit: OMFG HOW DID I MISS THAT INCONCEIVABLE JOKE!?

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We have a 4 year old on the team actually, not competing yet obviously, but he's here and he loves it. So the answer is is just whenever she wants to begin. Best bet is find a coach or trainer person who's willing to teach her and start her off with a mini bow (if you're thinking of using genesis bows, which I highly recommend). So as long as she can hold and pull back a bow without hurting herself or putting anyone in danger, shes ready to start training!

what's your DEX stat?

17

This isn't about the eyesight thing in particular, but I once saw a SportsScience episode that said NFL QB Drew Brees was more accurate than an Olympic archer. It was supposedly based on a competition between the two where Brees' throws hit the bullseye more consistently than the archer. I used to shoot a bow as a hobby when I was a kid (nowhere near competitive level, but I've handled a bow and have some general understanding of how accurate they can be) and I've always found that a little incredible. What's your opinion? Any chance it's true?

Could you show me the episode, it's hard to say anything for certain on either side until I see quite exactly what you're talking about.

I was able to find an article discussing it, and apparently Brees threw at the target from 20 yards while the archers did whatever their standard distance was. So it was kind of bullshit. Here's the article if you want to have a look. I think it has a link to the episode. https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/23/brees-more-accurate-than-olympic-archers-sort-of/

Yeah, plus ya know, a football is like 20x the diameter of an arrow. So as far as you, I, and even that article are concerned, that study was just basically false advertising lol.

did you use the force?

More of Yondu'd it from GoTG lol.

I feel you! I didnt get glasses until 6th grade and I'm blind as a bat, but I'm still a mad shot with a rifle and slingshot. My grandpa even took my glasses off once and asked me to shoot bullet shells off a tree and I was still able to do it even tho I couldnt see, cus I knew where they were.

Helpful talent for using an open scope, cus the scope kinda covers yer target a lil bit, or at least mine does

I was angry all of 4th grade in school cus I couldnt see the board in class. I thought the other kids were lying about being able to read it!

So how nice was it to see that trees had leaves when you first got your glasses?! That's what I was stoked about the most!

Damn, must have built up some intuitive muscle memory? That's pretty impressive!

I've noticed from a few comments from people talking about getting glasses/contacts that they noticed first and/or loved tree leaves, maybe that's some sort of human neurological thing? That the first thing we learn to appreciate is nature?

How did you aim? I know I just point it at the target and judge the vertical distance between the arrow tip and the target, but that wouldn't really work for you. As far as I know, every style of aiming uses the target. How'd you do it?

What draw weight are you using? I assume the Genesis in the background of your proof picture is yours?

The genesis I use is just the standard bow, which is what NASP tournaments require to be used for fair play. I currently have it set at a 20lb draw weight.

What I do to aim is I use a practice round to aim all my shots dead center, and once we go to collect, see where they actually go, and adjust from there. I could still "see" the target, so I could adjust based on it, but I couldn't see my arrows, the markings, the rings, or any details until I got closer.

Ah, gotcha. I've shot a low-weight Genesis before; it's definitely very different from my recurve but it's still fun!

Ah, I gotcha. So it is sorta like how I aim, just with much less feedback during rounds?

Exactly, as I put it earlier, "you dont need 20/20 vision to have 20/20 hindsight".

A good point!

Also, seriously well done! I'm a little jealous. You're doing much better than me while being much younger and much blinder than me! :)

Thanks man, and dont worry, keep practicing, you'll get those scores up!

What are some of your hobbies other than archery?

Also thanks for doing this AMA, it’s been a great monday morning read!

I do a lot actually lol, I play multiple instruments including drums, guitar, piano, and vocals. I'm in a track team. I play video games occasionally, although mostly semi-realistic mil-sims like the ghost recon games. I cook occasionally. I teach math classes. And I sometimes read or watch movies, TV, or YouTube.

That’s awesome! What kind of stuff have you been playing/listening to lately? I play drums and guitar as well, started when I was around your age.

On drums I'm currently doing a lot of The Mars Volta stuff like Viscera Eyes, it's just an instrument I'm naturally good at because I have an intuitive sense of rhythm.

On guitar it's a different story though. My friend is currently pushing me to learn Sweet Child O Mine's rhythm guitar, which I'm thankful for because I've been learning a lot, but it still is a very hard challenge for me.

Piano and vocals I just do when need be, drums and guitar are my main hobby instruments.

In terms of what I listen to, Alter Bridge and really anything Myles Kennedy or drum-ey are my favourites.

Wow. Very cool.

And memories of my childhood.

“You’re supposed to be able to read that?” to my grandfather at a bowling alley in the days of overhead projector type manual scoring and I kept walking over to look at the scoresheet on the table under the projector lamp, or would volunteer to keep score. Haha.

I’d been shooting both rifles and pistols well before that (and hitting targets, thankyouverymuch!), fishing and learning to cast to specific spots, and all the usual little kid outdoor sports and such. I couldn’t read the blackboard in class unless I sat in the front and even then it was was fuzzy. Always sat on the floor closer to the TV.

And somehow nobody noticed. Ha. Until grandpa kept the bowling score one day.

He started pointing things out in the bowling alley. “Can you read that sign over there?” Nope.

Hahaha. That first pair of glasses was amazing. Hey, so that’s how the world is supposed to look!

2nd grade I think. Might have been 3rd.

(Yes, I was shooting at that age. Heavy adult supervision. Nobody get all freaked out about that now, I know... scary guns and all that political noise... I was trusted with the .22 rifle by myself at 10, and no, not all kids should be. Even as kids some people are more responsible than others.)

Definitely a life changing day and week. I remember those first few days with glasses very well, and that was long ago.

I also remember the first day with progressives. Arghhhh! Hahaha. Welcome to your 40s! :-)

Sounds like your childhood was a blast! Glad to hear you found out quite a bit earlier than I did lol.

So, could you see the target from where you were shooting/standing? And if so, i take it was blurry right? Or could you not see the target really, and just had a general idea of where to shoot at? I saw in another comment that you said you were 14, and i just want to say, i am seriously fucking impressed with your skills dude. That's insane, and you should feel proud of yourself dude. I always loved archery, i just was never that good at it. Keep on letting them arrows fly dude! :) 👍

Thank you so much man, I was honestly worried people wouldn't care when posting.

Technically I could see the target, but it was just like a blurry colourful blob a ways away from me. Imagine putting the target 15 metres away from you, and then extending your arm and focusing on your hand. That out of focus target is sort of what I'd see when it was in focus.

Are your glasses T H I C C and if so, can we have a pic?

Unfortunately my glasses aren't particularly snack like but they are still incredibly helpful lol.

Have you ever tried VR glasses on? I read it helps a lot!

Well I have a virtual reality system and use it occasionally if that's what you're saying. Unfortunately havent noticed any positive changes for my vision :/.

What are the 11 steps to archery success?

Well really theres only three: equipment (bow, arrows, target, duh), patience, and determination. I sucked when I started. I sucked when I was three years in, but I kept at it. My scores gradually grew, I grew, my mentality grew, my patience grew, my stamina grew, and here I am, near the top (still dont have that 300.... yet).

Have you read the book Zen in the Art of Archery?

From memory, in the book he learns without a target for a long time, allowing him to perfect his physical technique without worrying about the target.

I havent even heard of it actually, but it sounds interesting. I'll make a note to check it out and share it with the team!

How do you not know you can't see shit?

Well it's not that I dint know, I just figured until recently it was normal. Some instances, like my chemistry class mentioned in one of my other replies, gave me doubts to my vision, but I didn't solidly know until recently.

Are you by any chance named Kevin? Lynne Ramsay has heavily prejudiced me against the whole fraternity of archers!! That damn movie...

Needless to say, an incredible feat mate. Best wishes to you for all your future endeavours! 😊

Unfortunately, I dont get that reference.

However, thank you so much, and good luck to you in life as well!

Were you able to watch TV and movies before?

Yes, just everything was essentially in like 480p to me, and subtitles were mostly illegible.

How do you resist the urge to shoot randomly in to the bleacher?

Laws, that's it. We'd all be serial killers if it weren't for those.

How exactly did you not notice being near sighted?

I just didnt know that people weren't supposed to be nearsighted. One day I just threw on my friends glasses as a joke and voilà.

And here I’ve had an opposite experience. I taught archery for 3 years at Girl Scout camp, and hobbies it for a while after that. But then I got a blood clot in my right eye (as a side effect of some other mega stuff) and now I can’t see to aim. So I’ve had to give up archery. I close my left eye and things like cars disappear. So there’s no real hope for me. :/

So glad you found the world of vision!!! Wait til you try contacts and find out what this whole “peripheral vision” thing is about!

Congrats on all of it young friend!

Thanks so much!

Sorry to hear about your eye, I hope it gets better eventually.

It’s been almost 5 years now. That vision is gone. But I gave my bow to a friend that is really enjoying it, so all is not lost.

I hope you stick with it. There’s more archery in the world than we realize and it’s a great way to get scholarships etc as you get older. Of course there’s also lots of friendships and travel and other experiences. But #1, have fun. :)

Well, at least not all the news is bad!

And thank you, so much!

How many broadheads have you buried in the chests of the rich in order to redistribute wealth?

Thank you, and congrats in the glasses :D

Edit: It's a robin hood joke

Each of my arrows are tipped with a hammer and sickle.

How did you adjust to shoot different distances?

Memorize where I need to aim, all I had was myself to use lol.

What do you think of the show Archer?

Who doesn't dream to be a top secret agent that's so good you can practically deadpool it through everything?

I LITERALLY just got my son a Genysis mini for his 11 year birthday. He's video game addicted, so we are trying to get him into something simlarly competitive and archery came highly recommended. I am not an experienced archer, so, what is your top five list for beginners?

Okay this is a long one, so strap in. Here's the most important steps to archery:

1: Workouts; that sounds scary but hold on, just 15 minutes of stuff like planks and basic stretches before every time you shoot. The last thing you want is to pull a muscle when you're holding a potentially lethal weapon.

2: Stance; you want to stand perpendicular to your target, feet parallel to eachother underneath your hips and shoulders. Dont rotate your waist, but turn your head, basically try to be as flat as you can without really trying to flat if that makes sense.

3: Take it slowly; go through the steps one by one. Extend your bow arm, knock an arrow, rest your fingers on the string, pull it back to your anchor point (detailed descriptions of all of these can be found with a quick Google search if you're not 100% sure what I mean), transfer, aim, release, follow through, lower your arm, and repeat. Each arrow can and should take around 20 seconds to send, theres no rush.

4: Adjust; this means both your aim and your stance. If you're aiming low, aim higher; if you're hitting your arm with the string, bend your arm slightly. There's no reason to hurt yourself.

5: Be patient; it took me three years to even begin to get good, it's going to take more than a day to even hit the target with all your arrows. Stick through it, keep adjusting, and you'll make progress.

Let's try this again.

What exactly is the point of posting about this, except to stroke your own ego?

Does anyone genuinely find your story about poor eyesight interesting? Does it go beyond the usual one-up you use on Friday nights to seem a tad more interesting than the average Joe?

Dude, I'm proud of the stuff I did. If you dont want people to be happy, share their experiences, or feel like they accomplished something, go back to your 1984-esque fantasy that is your moms basement. I'm just sharing my proudest moment in my life and you're trying to say I'm egotistical for doing so. You can say what you want, I honestly don't give a shit, just have fun living life the darkest way you possibly can.

I'm not going to put up with anyone trying to ruin my happiness, you're blocked. Get a therapist, fix your broken mind.

Did you sleep with your teacher?

No